Transcript: Mixed Environmental Progress Reviewed - Committee of the Whole Meeting - Wednesday, April 15, 2026 - 9:30 a.m. - City of Richmond Hill | Summary 72

Mixed Environmental Progress Reviewed - Committee of the Whole Meeting - Wednesday, April 15, 2026 - 9:30 a.m. - City of Richmond Hill

Good morning everybody. I'd like to call this meeting to order. I can't reach the gavl. If I if I could, I would gavvel us all in. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Okay. Welcome everybody. in chambers and watching us online. It's Wednesday, April the 15th. This is committee of the whole. I am your chair, W 5 counselor Karen Silvitz, and I've called to order. Um, next item on my agenda is council announcements. Anyone have any council announcements? Councelor Thompson. Uh, thank you very much. Um, I I did mention this uh last week, but I think it's worth mentioning again that uh on Thursday, April the 30th, I will be hosting a community safety and well-being um uh panel discussion. Uh I will have York Region Police. I'll have York Region Community Health u uh services. Uh our own um bylaw department, the mayor, as well as fire and emergency services. and they'll be there to answer uh anyone's questions. Um my I strongly recommend everybody to register at my website in advance, submit your questions to make sure that you can get your questions answered. So um thank you very much. That's uh it for now. I'll talk about my ecoest next time. Thank you, councelor uh councelor Davidson. Thank you, Madam Chair. Um, and next Thursday, April 23rd, I have a uh media savvy uh sort of discussion with Andrea Case, an old friend of mine from CTV News. She's an anchor and we're going to talk about how do you spot news that is legitimate? How do you steer free of misinformation and that is at 6 PM in the Norm Norm Taylor room at Bond Lake Arena. So, I hope people come out, check out my website to sign up. Thank you. What's the date on that, Madam Counselor? April 23rd. Thank you. Okay. Any further announcements? Seeing none. Okay. Uh do we have any introduction of emergency and time sensitive matters? Seeing none, I'll move for the adoption of the agenda. Could I have someone councelor Shu? All those in favor? Passes unanimously. Thank you. Any disclosures of pecuniary interest in the general nature thereof? Seeing none, um identification of items requiring separate discussion. So we have um one two three four uh four items on our uh on our agenda. We have some additions and then we have councilor shoes member motion. So um because we're having a presentation that agenda item 11.2 two is is automatically going to be discussed and of course um the member motion. So does anybody else on council wish to pull any other agenda item? Seeing none. Okay. Thank you. So if we could I could have someone move for the remainder. Thank you. Deputy Mayor Chan. So moved. All those in favor? Adoption of the remainder gender items passes unanimously. Thank you. We have no public hearings and we have one presentation and our presentation today is by Miles O'Brien, our sustainability coordinator regarding the 2025 environment strategy progress update and environment scorecard which is as I said our agenda item 11.2. This will be a 15inut presentation and I'm really looking forward to it. Welcome sir. The floor is yours. Great. Thank you. Okay. Well, thank you to the chair and members of council, uh, members of committee and guests. I'm pleased today to present Richmond Hill's second environmental scorecard as part of our environment strategy progress report. Good, the clicker works. Uh so this presentation will provide just a brief overview of the context and the purpose of the scorecard, its format and design uh and its contents. So the data, the trends and messages and uh finally I'll touch on how we will share and use the scorecard. And I believe most people um at these desks in front of me should have a a paper copy as well if you want to flip through that while we're uh talking about it. Uh so the context the environmental scorecard is really a tracking and communications tool for our environment strategy and that strategy spans 2014 to 2031. The strategy requires a scorecard to be published every 5 years. So the first scorecard was released in 2021 covering the first five years of implementation of the strategy from 2015 to 2019. And I can assure you that there's five years within there. Even though you might be thinking it looks only like four years. We've done the math. There's five. Okay. And the purpose of the scorecard. So it's meant to track progress towards our goals uh to share information with the public uh and to help influence and inform future decision making. It also provides accountability to council and to our community. Um, as you may be familiar with the environment strategy strategy, it's very much um a community document as much as it's a city document. Um, so it's a the scorecard is a great way to report back to the community. It also complements the ongoing work of our internal um environment strategy steering committee and that's been in place since day one. Okay. So, what does it look like? Well, the first environment scorecard, as I said, released in 2021, um, instead of, uh, I guess instead of gathering all 90 actions from the strategy and reporting on those, it really takes a sampling of indicators and it uses data for those indicators um, to provide snapshots of progress on the strategies, themes. It also sets visually a template for how to organize and present that content. So then the second one that you have in front of you, um it follows that template really. Uh so a lot of the same design features that are in the first, the infographics, did you know boxes, uh battery icons, those sorts of things, those are also continued in the second, although it we tried to give it its own look. Uh, so it's really meant to be a short, visually appealing, easy to read way to communicate information uh that matters to the city and to the community. And I'll note that the scorecard is developed by the sustainability section within the planning and uh building services department, but it really depends on inputs from various uh other business units at the city who either lead or co-lead actions in the environment strategy. uh our communications team also reviews the document. So it's very really very much a collaborative effort to uh to put this forward. Okay. So getting into the contents we have three greening principles in our strategy. So we follow that um that template more or less for the scorecard. Uh so the scorecard features uh greening our consumption spread and we have three indicators within that. uh we have um greenhouse gas emissions uh and energy use, water use, and then uh waste uh generation and diversion. And I'll get into a couple of examples a little more deeply, but just to kind of get an overview of what it looks like, we have greening our natural spaces with tree canopy and natural heritage, community gardens, and water quality and storm water management. And then the third one is greening our growth. uh and that features new development uh sustainability performance and sustainable transportation options as the indicators. So looking a bit more at what is the data, what are the trends, what are the messages and I sorry I should mention I meant to point this out before um even though this scorecard um technically is for the years 2020 2020 to 2024 um we thought wherever possible we'll use the full 10 years of data. So 2015 to 2024 uh to tell those stories. we we felt that those would be stronger messages and stronger trends. So as an example um looking at green air consumption one of the uh indicators is water use. So the the data here tells us that um over that that 10-year period the average per capita use of water uh decreased by more than 10%. and the average uh daily use in our facilities of water decre decreased by more than 30%. So we would consider that good progress as you can see by the green battery icon there. Uh and then in our status and next steps just as an example um we explain in the status well um give a bit of context for that trend. So in this case we're saying that it's really better technology, better habits uh as well as uh our proactive maintenance and repair and replacement or infrastructure and equipment that's led to these decreases. Our next step shows um or kind of reflects our commitment around um decreasing and and really using water wisely. Uh okay an example from greening our natural spaces around um tree canopy. Um so in this case the data was available in 2012 and 2022 but it still gives us uh a 10ear span and we can see that our tree canopy growth or tree canopy um increased um by more than 5% in that in that time. Um there's additional data that you can see to the right that that kind of gives a bit more or rounds out the our understanding of that. So we can see how many trees were planted through our community stewardship and capital restoration work as well as how many hectares of lands land were restored. Uh and this is a great reflection of of really that collaboration between um city and community to achieve this um impressive result. Okay. And the third greening uh principle greening our growth. So the example here is new development sustainability performance. So in this case we take a target from our community energy and emissions plan or seep which is a 90% uh so the target there is that 90% of of new development um will will take place in the Young Street Highway 7 and other infill areas by 2050. Uh the infographic on the right shows that since 2015 uh the percentage of um residential development application units located within intensification areas has been increasing. So we're on our way to that target. Um you'll notice that the battery icon in in this case is stable. Um and there's a reason for that which is reflected in our hold on in our uh status box. Um so in this case we felt progress is stable because yes a lot of growth has been directed where we want it. Um but we still need have work to do when it comes to really making sure that those um buildings themselves actually incorporate sustainable design and our next steps reflects how the city can use the tools available to us um to keep growing in that way. Okay. So overall uh looking at data and trends from this time period, we can say through the scorecard that Richmond Hill is generally making progress on its environmental goals knowing that uh there are still areas of improve of improvement. How is that progress being achieved? really largely through data from monitoring program programs and studies uh through investments in infrastructure maintenance upgrades piloting uh and adopting innovative practices and technology engaging and collaborating with the community and leveraging partnerships and this is reflected in the environment strategy report as well. Oops, sorry. There we go. The last couple slides here. So, how we will share this sore card. So, the printed copies that you have in front of them, those will be made available at public events and city facilities. And we're excited to uh share these copies at our upcoming uh Earth Day event this Saturday at the central library. Uh we'll also publish a digital version on our website as well as sharing links and and short uh animated videos kind of highlighting the scorecard uh through our social media platforms. And finally, how we will use the scorecard. So when we developed our environment strategy update in 2022, we did use insights from the first scorecard to inform that update. So similarly, staff will apply these sort of lessons and insights from the second scorecard to keep strengthening our environmental performance uh as especially as we move into our our third and final phase of implementation of the strategy. So ultimately the scorecard remains an important tracking and communa communication tool uh for achieving our greening goals and I'm happy to um take any questions you might have. That concludes the presentation. Thank you. Thank you very much. Um, one one question just before we open it up. Um, you said there's the Earth Day event on Saturday at the library. Could you explain a little bit more for anybody who's listening, our residents, exactly what that is? Sure. Yeah, I'm happy to. So, 12:30 to 3:30 at the Central Library. Uh, it's an Earth Day event um that's open to everyone. It's free. Uh it's very family oriented and really it offers a number of ways of I'd say connecting with some of the environmental themes that you'd see in the scorecard or in the strategy. Uh so everything from uh pollinators, gardening, um tree canopy uh and wildlife to um transportation. So, for example, we'll have um the opportunity to uh try some micromobility devices. Um that'll be part of uh part of the release of our strategy for micromobility tied into Earth Day. Um there will be presentations uh workshops. So, for homeowners, for example, they could learn um how to uh build a rain garden on their property. Um, so a whole variety of activities, information, um, booths. I believe there will be some snacks there that Ruth is providing. Thank you, Ruth. Um, so again, very familyfriendly. Um, great place to learn more. You can, um, ask questions to staff, to some of our partners, um, to learn more, to network. Um, and it it should be a fun time, but also a good good chance to really uh gain some familiarity with um with our environmental work at the city. That sounds fantastic. Thank you. Um, we'll definitely be there and I hope to see many of our residents there. Okay. So, in front of us, we have the presentation. Members of council, um, thank you, councelor Davidson. Um, could would you like to move the agenda item and the presentation at the same time so we can have that discussion all together? Is that okay? Yes. All good. Okay. So, um, Councelor Davidson, are you still on that? Okay. So, so we've got a, uh, the presentation and agenda item 11.2. We're moving it together. Uh, so moved by Councelor Davidson. Councelor Davidson, floor is yours. Yes, we're putting it all together. Yep. Great. Thank you. Through you, Madam Chair. Um, thank you. This is a great visual. Um, and you can kind of pick out the stuff you want. And I'm always so um grateful and overwhelmed at our tree canopy in particular. It it's it's the difference between living in a in a you know, concrete jungle and living in in paradise. As far as I'm concerned, um, the one thing I did want to ask the storm water, how much salt is in Lake Wilcox, which is on the inside part, the green. I know we're coming back with a you're coming back with a salt report to to to council, but when we say it's up 64%. What is that? Is that are we at a at a critical point? I don't know whether salt can kill a lake, but can it? And what's what's the cause? And can we do anything about it? First thing I'll say is, yeah, I definitely don't want to speak for our our um water resources and storm water crew. um they can answer that much better than I can. So I I really can only reflect what they've told me um which is that the primary source is is road salt. Um that's how the chloride's getting in. Um it's looking at at the levels um you know it's sort of a gradual but consistent increase yearbyear. Um I know there's been lots of discussions throughout the organization on you know on ways to mitigate that. Um but it my understanding again is is the reality of you know especially a we have a winter like this one road salt is still the best way to keep the road safe. Um as far as whether the you know whether the lake is dying or not. I haven't been told anything kind of that extreme. I all I know is that it's um it's an issue that's that's really top of mind for that group. There's just not a clear, you know, clear-cut solution. Um but it's certainly something that I know they are focused on and and looking, you know, to work with um other groups in the in the city to address. Uh I don't want to say more than that because I I think uh the experts should speak to it, but that's that's my understanding. So it's uh in terms of the levels um you know I haven't been told anything I guess along the lines of the lake is dying but I wasn't in in three you mad I wasn't indicating that it was I was asking could it could it so I think further comment go ahead yes go ahead through you madam chair yes we actually have great news that we're working on a project with York region and the Toronto region and conservation specifically for lake Wilcox at this time. It's a pilot. They're looking at different ways to use plant materials, planting new species u to actually prevent further uh you could say erosion and salt entering the lake. So this is a pilot right now and hopefully through that work and that study uh we should be able to find a bit more information on how we could pre it's basically adaptation. We're looking at at ways to prevent further um leakage into of salt into the lake. Yes. Thank you. Um I mean I could talk about every single thing in here, but I'll I'll I'll go back to the to the chair. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Next person on the speakers list is Council Thompson. Uh thank you very much. And uh through you the chair, I I do want to start by just recognizing something that was in the report that certainly caught my eye and that's the uh 6% reduction uh in energy consumption and um really that's the kind of progress that we're obviously hoping to to to get from a corporate perspective. But the other thing that caught my eye in that same paragraph, which is if anybody wanted to look it up in the report, it's on page four under the energy section, and that's the last paragraph. And despite our efforts where we've got that 6% uh reduction in energy consumption, the total emissions actually increased by 2.6%. which if I understand correctly would be largely due to the more carbonintensive uh provincial energy mix. So you know I'm I'm you know I think it's understood I think I saw it elsewhere in one of the other reports that that's because of natural gas uh that the province is uh seems to to be moving more towards. So, I hate to say it this way, but it sounds like that we're getting dirtier uh energy generation over these years than what we had even previously. And so, we may and I don't know maybe you have I because I didn't see it in the trends. You may have something about trends there between 2015 and 2020 and then 2020 to 24. Is that actually a trend that we're seeing? is that, you know, proincially we're not getting as good energy generation than what we've had. Good point, Mr. O'Brien. So, just sorry, just to be clear, so you're wondering with within our own data if we're seeing a reflection of the change in the mix of energy proincially. Yeah. So, I'm I'm trying to I guess I'm trying to to sort out that it looks like we're doing everything at the municipal level that we, you know, can control, but there's a component here that we can't control. And so, I'm I'm trying to ascertain where we are in that whole mix. So that's why I'm sort of I have more questions, but I'm just trying to get an understanding that there's a component here we can't control and I'm trying to find out what that trend is for that component that we can't control. Mr. Ab. Yeah, I'd say well the trend on the side that we can control is probably hard to speak to. I mean I guess um it's out of our control. Um, so you know, the mix of of uh energy within the province, um, you know, it it certainly got a lot cleaner from 20 years ago when we, you know, we had coal burning plants. Um, now that they've introduced more natural gas into the mix to produce electricity, there's more GHD emissions uh, from that. the part I guess that we can control I guess you know hypothetically if the city uh completely detached itself from the grid and produced all of its own energy you know cleanly um that would be you know that would be one way to I guess do everything that we could but that's you know um that would be that would be a a tall order um so I think uh I think reasonably speaking yes we've done a a lot of what we can do um especially around you know a lot of the a lot of the changes that you may not notice um where when it comes to you know equipment upgrades and you know finding those efficiencies um that's that's where my understanding again where a lot of those savings have come in uh is is you know um making upgrades making replacements um in a in a consistent way Um, so that's what I would consider where, you know, we've we've uh we have an achievement there and we've, you know, we've been fairly um I don't know if I could say aggressive, but um I think very consistent uh in following that path. And that's where, you know, I think the city has done what it can do um short of, like I say, kind of going off-rid and uh producing all of its energy on its own. So I think as long as we are dependent on the grid, we are going to be dependent on what that mix is. Mr. Rendan, you wish to comment. Director Flores, you wish to say anything as well through the chair. Um with just respect to your comment on the province um yes there is a greater mix of natural gas uh which has affected emissions but the province to be fair has also been um setting up programs as you know to to promote renewable energy which we are also participating in. So as Miles had had noted it's it's in the way we reduce dependency on the fuel and the emissions that is also a great part of it. Right. and uh through the chair. I I definitely appreciate that. Uh I guess and and uh Mr. O'Brien, you actually touched on it in terms of short of us moving in a different direction where we're actually the ones now getting involved with um uh energy generation. Um, maybe that's what I should be talking about here because if we're going to meet our 2050 targets and what we're seeing during this last period and maybe it's just a blip, not you know that the but if there is this trend that you know it's not taking us where we want in terms of greenhouse gas emissions then do we have to start looking at how we prioritize what we do moving forward. So maybe we do have to start to escalate those types of initiatives if we're ever going to meet our 2050 targets. Mr. Rendan, go ahead. through you, Madam Chair. I definitely agree that from a municipal level, we have more opportunities to do more work outside of the provincial mandate where they're not providing us as much provincial, you could say even monetary support subsidies to support local say retrofits. Um, we through our work have the climate ready homes pilot program that we've initiated. This is an opportunity for homeowners to retrofit their houses to be more energy efficient. Uh we're doing a pilot right now with TRCA and that's been pretty um it's pretty successful in regards to how we're engaging the public. Um another example of the work that we're doing here is like we're promoting through the ISO solar businesses to to put solar on top of their buildings. So we're doing that type of work as well. Um just want to mention that we are doing a feasibility study for local improvement charges that's going to be coming up in June. That study is looking at ways so that we could pro potentially provide funding for homeowners in regards to local improvement for their homes and retrofit or deep retrofits where projects cost thousands of dollars, not simple small rain gardens. It's more like that's put solar panels in your home. That project also includes um opportunities for us and recommendations potentially for us to engage further in our work. Look at other ways that we can engage the community in doing better in EDSO reduced GHG emissions and we're also looking at adaptation opportunities as well. So I feel from a municipal perspective we're doing uh we're very proactive. We're very proactive. We're learning from our uh other local municipalities and learning what they're doing to make sure that we're all working together collaboratively, not duplicating efforts when we do our work. So that's upcoming and that the reporting for our SEP will also give you some information there as well. We know unfortunately it's it's nothing that we could do from a provincial level and federal government level. if they don't help and support us, we're we're doing above and beyond, I believe, in terms of the work that we're we're trying to get our residents and even within the corporation. Now, the corporate energy that we're doing here is wonderful as well through Plaid's work. Um, so I I I feel that that's a way that we could do our work. Thank you. Thank you through the chair. So it it sounds like we are looking at how we may have to prioritize our investments moving forward so that we can stay on target for our 2050 uh commitments. Uh if I've heard that correctly here, um you talked about uh the collaboration with the TRCA. Is this something that you would be tracking like if you're going to track the emissions? Uh is that per unit of energy or maybe a per square foot per facility or something like how would we actually isolate the efficiency gains from um you know the grid impacts like are we doing anything in that regard through you madam chair no that project right now uh there is going to be a monitoring component to see if there's actually resident um uptake and are they actually doing all of this work to help uh that they're supporting them to do at this time. Um that uh actually accounting for the for the data. No, that's not part of the project, but it could be something that we could look at as part of the SEEP update, the SE work that we're doing. Okay. Again, all in all, I I love what we're doing here. I I I definitely appreciate the report and yeah, I believe that as a municipality we're doing everything right and that we're trying to move things or move the needle in the right direction. Um I'm just concerned, you know, I don't care. I'll throw the province under the bus. I just it just seems to me that, you know, we're we're putting two feet forward, but we're having to step back because of our partners here. So, uh those are my comments. Thank you very much. Thank you, councelor. Next on my speakers list is uh uh regional counselor depala. Thank you, Madam Chair. Um just just want to say over overall I'm so so pleased to see these results and um pleased to see it laid out like this and you know pretty fairly easy to understand. So much good work that's being done. I also highlight like our our tree canopy and it's it's not it's not stated in exaggerated terms. Our total coverage went from roughly 25 to 30%. You're stating a 5% increase, but really it's 20% increase in in uh the tree canopy coverage. So, you know, nothing misleading here. The only stat um that well I I found is amazing to know that less than 5% it's currently going to landfill. Uh our diversion has been amazing. I was on this council when we brought in the recycling program. We were 100% uh going to landfill and we're down to less than 5%. I'm just wondering, you don't have a 2012 to 2022 um you know statistic in in in that one category. You're not seeing the percentage increase. Do we know do you know where we were uh 10 15 years ago with diversion? And yeah, I don't have through the chair. I don't have that data in front of me exactly. Uh I know from what we looked at generally speaking with waste diversion it's been pretty stable uh since the blue box and green bin programs uh got underway which I believe the green bin came in around 2007 or so. So I think within the the 10 years we're talking about um there has not been much fluctuation uh which which is great. I think we've, you know, we've hit a really good level of waste diversion. 95% over 95% from land diverting from landfill is great and it's been going on for a while. Well, I you know, I'm just really pleased to see a lot of these numbers and I think we we've got to talk more about it. I think we this report is great and we need to get it out, get the message out to the residents of Richmond Hill, what uh what stewards we've been of our natural environment and all these efforts that we're making. Um, and it's great and I'd love to see a little more what's happened from 2022 until now is through three or four years probably numbers are even better. I I would assume and um is there are we do we track this kind of stuff every five years or something? Is it do we have would would we be expecting more recent data uh through the chair? It's it's tracked every year. Um, okay. And yeah, the intention was to produce a scorecard every 5 years. Um, because, you know, because the data for a given year isn't typically available until the following year. Um, that's why, for example, this scorecard, uh, the data goes up to 2024. Um, so we sort of spent 2025 collecting the data, putting together the scorecard. Um, but yeah, the intention would be in another five years to go through the same process. Great. Great. Well, we're trending the right way, that's for sure. Okay. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, sir. Next on my speakers list is Councelor Shu. Thank you, Madam Chair, and uh thank you for your presentation and great work put into the uh environmental strategy. Just a quick questions on slide number nine uh regarding sustainable transportation options. Um I was bit surprised to see that the share of the residents using sustainable uh moles seems to have dropped from 23% in 2020 2016 to 18 uh.2% in 2021 uh within five years. So in my concept maybe I'm wrong we should have seen more people using s sustainable transportation over the past few years. So can you just clarify one more time if this data is only covered uh 2021 during the pandemic or is it covers from 2020 to 2024 through the chair that's a good question for certain uh data sets or data points the the data is only available uh or or is only collected uh perhaps you know on a five or 10 year basis. So in this case it is just from that 2021 as you mentioned. Um I don't know 100% but I I have a feeling that um the pandemic uh may help to explain some of the drop in transit use. I think that was a a trend you know beyond just Richmond Hill. Uh so 2021 kind of being in the thick of that time. Um I suspect that may have had something to do with it. I guess we'll have to see what our numbers show us um you know as we came out of the pandemic and and hopefully hopefully that number would improve uh but again because of when that data is collected we won't see until that's available. Yeah, maybe even after the pandemics uh more people having have been working in hybrid mode and even fewer daily commuters overall. So I'm just wondering if the smaller base might be affecting how we collecting and reading the data. So maybe that's the reason why there's a drop of 5% from 2016. It may be the reason. And my another question is um will future phases of the data include micromobility options through madam chair. Yeah through the chair. Um 100%. I think that's that's exactly the intention is as we keep building in uh more and better options say around sustainable transportation we can start tracking those things and and reporting on them as well. Um so um we're at the stage now where we're we're moving into the next phase of uh of the strategy and the scorecard and those are the exact sort of conversations we'll be having is how can we uh how can we um incorporate or capture some of the the the new options or the new progress that we've made into our reporting. Yeah. So I have to say scorecard is a very good initiative. I have to say this. Thank you so much. And my last comment is I'm happy to see that uh there's a section in greening our natural spaces uh to see the city's effort in preserving and planting trees and I look forward to seeing how the city continues to protect and ensure sufficient green space for neighbors including those neighbors living in condominiums communities and higher density areas. Um I totally understand various provincial bills uh may change the definitions or requirements related to green space in the development application in bylaw amendment applications but I still hope the city can continue to protect the parkland dedication and the sufficient green space for the residents living in the condominiums communities and especially for the south side of the city. That's my last comment. Thank you madam chair. Thank you, councelor. Next person on my speakers list. Oh, I'm sorry. Go ahead. Oh, I'm sorry. I was looking down. Go ahead, Mr. Through you, Madam Chair. Thank you so much for those comments. I do want to say that we have launched in our office a natural heritage strategy and prioritization tool. Um, it's a project that has been initiated by our group in collaboration with our other uh teams in P&HP, UFH. Um, and it's going to be looking at opportunities where we could do uh more plantings, work, we could do restorations, what's flora and fauna we're protecting, where we could potentially get grants so that we could go and plant more and continue to create and grow our natural heritage system and our open space system. So, I think this is Thank you. Um, this is good news and and hopefully you could keep an eye out on how that project progresses. Thank you. Good to know. That's all my comments. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you. Thank you, councelor. Next on my speakers list is Deputy Mayor Chan. Thank you very much, uh, Madame Chair, and thank you for the presentation. And I I have to say that, um, in particular for the presentation, this is a good show and tell. If I were a teacher saying in front of grade five kids, hey, look, it's very colorful to get their attention. Of course, adults included. Great work. Um uh actual contra shield touch on a couple items that I want to ask. Transportation is one but I guess the explanation is there because uh where I sit in the region the YT transit figures totally the other way. Water should have been up but but it's a time period we're talking about. So um I'll park that question since already been answered. Um and the other topic is also on the natural heritage and urban forest. It's great that we have this successful I would call successful based on the turnout community stewardship program through planning and spring now we're already promoting it uh but often I hear from uh resident come back to me oh godwin uh we participate in the tree planting in this corridor but we went back and the trees are not healthy some might not actually uh survive. So through you madame chair it's great to have we have x number of trees being planted this year five years but perhaps this is not a PKI or h particular key indicator you want to look at but maybe I I'm just curious as to madame chair the efforts may also look particular from a sustainability planning is one thing uh how many were actually surviving and continue the boom so to speak. Is there any particular um attempt to kind of tally those through you uh madam chair? Go ahead. Through you uh madam chair. Yes, we work closely with our FN partners um and operations and they do have uh my understanding a maintenance program for the delivery of trees. We look at not only the planting planning but also the longevity and and the growth of them surviving as well. Thank you. Thank you very much. I'm glad to hear that because next time when I hear the same thing is that the city is doing what it can but you know it's all manufacturers right? Um we have used uh whatever less salt whatever than on the road maybe it makes a difference. So thank you. So we have actually those measures and I it's a comment I'm glad in terms of restoration work on a number of places be a woodland dio park and fis venison park and so on um because um there seems to be um there's some kind of um uh how I put it uh I don't know it's uh information is correct they say oh we actually have less the tree we store it in certain parks. Uh but based on what you're saying or what we see in the staff report in the presentation, that's not the case. Um and so which I'm glad to see and um so keep it up on that one. Um the other one is on a healthy yacht is uh coming wildlife and uh I find it really interesting that the city is actually working with turtle guardian Oak Ridges Turtle Chapter one of my colleague Oak Ridges uh may have get involved in that but but I think that is great. Um, so I'd like to see more progress over the years because at York Region um we did a uh uh staff actually now um the uh almost endangered species I got the name right the uh um salamander they actually now can use tunnel so the yacht region doesn't have to close off uh uh a stovey road between lassie and bay so hopefully this would be kind of sharing the experiences how we can really help to further make it life I don't know easy is the right word but for help uh the wildlife to uh to have food and nesting that there's more support. So thank you all and I look forward to maybe 18th is Earth Day um exhibit or you call it Central Library. Thank you very much. I'm happy to support the motion thing is in front of us. Thank you Madame Chair. Thank you. Thank you uh Deputy Mayor Chan. Appreciate it. So, I've got no more speakers on my speakers list. Is there anybody else in the first round who does wish to speak? Seeing none. Okay. The only comment I have is thank you very much as always. Um a a brilliant presentation and this um the scorecard is outstanding. Thank you so much to everybody for um all all staff that who have uh worked on this. I just have one question um with regards to so on slide 11 we talk about the tree canopy. And we say that we have only increased oh thank you our tree canopy by um 5.3%. Um over a period of 10 years. Um is that figure in any way was that figure negatively impacted by the fact that we had to take down thousands and thousands of ash trees. is is there there must be some kind of a a there must a scale there because I would expect it to be more miss through you madam chair I don't specifically know the details but I would assume so the amish al bore the removal of thousands of trees that came to the city as well and then there's the nature in itself the the ice storms and stuff have also caused and created hazardous trees that had to be removed as well yes I would assume that that would be the primary factor. Okay. Thank you. Commissioner, you wish to add anything. Uh three, Madame Chair, I would just say it's a summary of the city as a whole, right? So, it's whatever we lost plus whatever we gained, so it does account for both. Yeah. Well, hopefully those little insects will stay away and we can we can although we've we've got a problem with oaks coming. So, but never mind. Hopefully we can continue to grow and get even greater uh greater coverage on our canopy. So um seeing no one else, does anybody wish to speak on the second round? Seeing none. Okay. So in front of us we have um agenda item 11.2 two and the presentation to be received with thanks. And the recommendation is that council receive the staff report including the attached um uh the attachments and the and the environmental scorecard for information purposes and that all comments be referred back to staff. All those in favor that passes unanimously. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much. And to all those watching online, just as an FYI, the reason Mayor West is not with us today is because he is busy in Germany on a trade mission and we wish him well. Thank you very much. Okay, so we have no delegations and the next item then would be we have no emergency timesensitive matters. So before we move for adjournment, oh the m Oh, I'm sorry. I'm so ahead of myself. Councelor Shu, see it's I'm I've turned the page. My apologies, councelor Shu. We have a member motion by councelor Shu that we need to attend to. Go ahead, sir. Thank you, Madam Chair. Uh actually this motion uh came from a few neighbors who are interested in speaking at the council but at the same time they are concerned about having their full address published on the public record. Um as we know under the current procedure bylaw uh delegates are required to provide full address and name and that and that information is published uh on the public record and permanently archive. So I would say this practice may have made sense in the past but um in today's digital environment it raises concern about the privacy breaches and even identity theft and in my view this is an issue worth addressing. So I've talked to the city clerk and mayor west to explore if we can modernize our procedure bylaw to better reflect today's realities. And uh I just want to u u emphasize one more time this motion does not reduce transparency. The city will continue to collect and verify full information internally. The only change is how personal information is published and displayed on public records. in brief uh for residents uh only show their names and what number for those non-residents only the name and municipality for business organization only shows uh the business name uh the representative names as well as the city of operation so I do believe this approach maintains accountability preserve transparency and protects privacy at the same time and I respectfully ask all my council colleagues to support this motion and I'm happy to take any questions here. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you. Okay, we have some speakers. Um, deputy mayor Gardon Chan. Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you cons forward. Um, I I I do appreciate the um uh rationale for that. uh in the past I also had res approach me um uh along similar things but but just for you madame chair maybe there's a question to the Mr. Kirk, I think that in the past I have seen that um when the um become public records the incoming email of residents was being blocked off. Um so is that something the practice already been doing that other than for public delegate they would have to state the name address through madam chair just want to be clear because I have seen that before in public record being information block out um thank you through the chair so uh there's two different practices it not two different practices there's practices based on how the public partic participation happen. So under the procedure bylaw uh for delegations and correspondents uh and public forum they are required to provide their name and address not email address. So like the the physical property address which is included in the agenda. Uh certainly my office receives a lot of correspondence uh by email which is included on the public record where we do redact the email address because that's not a requirement of the current procedure by law but if you note their residential their physical property address is still included. Gotcha. Thank you. So uh yeah so I'm glad to have those uh practices uh further uh um explained to us that that's good. Um and um I have no issue with the um the motion itself. I'm happy to support it understanding where it coming from and the reason the reason behind it. Uh but just to be absolutely clear um uh maybe this is a question direct either the clerk or um our city solicitor. um under a uh any other provincial legislation um would in this in adopting this is in no way, form or shape uh have potential conflict with uh or maybe align with the municipal freedom of information and protection policy act through Madame Chair. Mr. Clerk, thank you uh through the chair. So uh our current practices absolutely aligned with the Municipal Freedom of Information Protection of Privacy Act. The adoption of this motion will not change that. Under that legislation when we're talking about um the collection, use and disclosure of personal information. Uh if we have legislative authority to do so and in need, we do so. And this uh clause a absolutely aligns with that and uh actually in in many ways recognizes the intent of the personal privacy rules in MIPA. Thank you for that and and yes uh I I actually think that would be the case but I think it's good to be actually heard in a public forum so that is into public record. Uh thank you and as I mentioned earlier madam chair I'm in support but just seeking those clarification. Thank you for the answers and thank you madam chair. Thank you Dr. Next person on my speakers list is councelor Davidson. Thank you and uh thank you to councelor um Shu for bringing this forward. I do have questions though. So through madam chair, can you tell me um Mr. Clerk, why were addresses included on delegations and letters in the first place? What was the motivation? Mr. clerk. Um, thank you uh through the chair. Uh, what I can say is that was a policy decision even before my time as clerk. Uh, but I do recall early in my, uh, tenure as clerk of this municipality that members of council at that time were um, uh, certainly wanted to see those addresses on the agenda. uh a and and I believe it was even said in a public meeting that it was important to them from a decision-making uh role so that they knew where the delegations the information was coming from. So it was uh simply a policy decision uh that was important to the decision makers uh the members of council at that time. Thank you. Um through you madam chair. Has the clerk's office ever received a complaint from anyone who has been a delegate or sent in a letter that they felt that their address had allowed someone to be abusive towards them or in any way harm them? Mr. Clerk. Um, thank you. Uh, through the chair, I'm going to be very careful here because I can't reveal personal information that's not in the public form. I I will say that my office uh and I have put in place under the broad authority of the city's access and privacy policy a procedure to redact personal information from the online version of records. So current minutes that might be posted from even 10 years ago if they have someone's address. We have in place a procedure to redact addresses in very very limited circumstances because they're public records, right? um where there is more than a mere suggestion there is a real possibility of risk to the health safety and well-being of the person to whom that relates and I I I will tell you that we have done some of those redactions in some cases um for persons whose career and I won't mention their careers because I don't want to put that in the public forum absolutely having their address in a public thing would be very dangerous to Um we have had suggestions that there is a general risk of having people's addresses out there. Uh but uh we have no cases where that's actually been implemented. Um, one of the examples that I I've given to people is that, you know, if there was a person that had a a uh in place um what do they call the um a protection against people restraining order someone that would absolutely be evidence and we would not want to do that. So we have this procedure in place already where people's addresses if they're in those real circumstances not mere speculation real circumstances we will with the proper evidence redact from the online version just the online version uh those addresses um the official paper copies will still retain those that information are still public documents but that's we achieve a real balance there between um the dis use and disclosure and protecting people's. Thank you madam counselor. Thank you through Mr. Chair. So there is the option to not have your address there if a resident reaches the criteria that the that your office has set up in terms of feeling that it's a threat or a risk. Mr. Clerk. Um thank you through the chair. Yes, but it's retroactive. So it's after the fact. The way the procedure bio is currently structured, I have no grounds not to Yeah. nor do I have time quite frankly to say no no no I I I can put your name on a current agenda without your address simp because we don't have time to there's a lot of iteration that happens when we're we're we're adapting that personal information collecting evidence we wouldn't be able to do that it's always after the fact thank you um how what concerns me about this is I feel like the address gives legitimacy to the delegate and to the letter writer what in what ways can we protect the city or this council from receiving a bunch of anonymous letters that just say, "Yeah, I live in Ward One without any extra level of accountability for the person who's trying to either lobby or influence a decision by this council." A very good point, Mr. Clerk. So uh and I might have to this might be a policy decision that I I will uh have to defer to the council but I will say this that the way this motion is structured my office is still required to collect those actual full addresses but I will also say we don't verify that Mr. Smith lives at 123 John Street. we have to rely on them to have hopefully been truthful in in in the submitting of their request or their correspondence. We we have no way to verify that because that would we just don't um we'll still be collecting those addresses as it says in my office because we need to maintain that for notifications under the planning act or the heritage act or what other legislation. But what will appear on the public record, the agenda and minutes will merely be award number reflecting that address that they submit to us that once again we have no way to verify whether they're being truthful. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I I still personally believe your address is one more step in verif verifying who somebody is. Um, and like I'm just worried that democracy depends on open transparency and it depends on people willing to speak up and that includes being on the record. And if it's not your email address, maybe it's your address. But I also realize the reality of the nastiness of social media and all the ways people can try to damage you from afar with just a bit of information. So, I'm really torn about this, but I wanted to know to you, Madam Chair, how much of an administrative nightmare would it be to have a a check on the box to submit a letter or to speak that says, "I don't want my information published and leave it as an option." Because I'll tell you, I have reached out to people who put their address down. I've looked them up and tried to talk to them about issues. And it's some people want to be want to be contacted about whatever they're passionate about enough to come to council. How how impossible would it be to have it as an option? Thank you, Mr. Clerk. I believe we already have that option when when someone is putting in their name for a deputation online. I'm saying with this with this motion it optional that if you do not want your information published, please tick this box. Otherwise, it will pre be presented with your correspondence. So u thank you uh through the chair. I actually believe that that would be very challenging. Um and I think uh what you would actually end up having just based on what we see is that most people would say no I don't want that information. So it's certainly my advice and that was my advice to councelor Shu when he was discussing this motion was that administratively for my office it's one or another. Um, and while I I certainly respect that, you know, a member of council would like to reach out to that person directly, I I I I would also suggest that there's the opportunity for that person to reach out to you directly and have that iteration if they really wanted to go beyond. Uh, but administratively for my office, respectfully, it's it's one or the other. That's it's either full address or full ward number or none. We can't operate. The perfect example would be the most recent cycle where we had 140 pieces of correspondence um where they all had their name and their address included in that agenda. A mixed bag of yes and no could generate more questions and consistency in the public record is really important. Thank you to you, Madam Chair. respectfully that 140 was is an anomaly that doesn't usually happen. And I'm I'm really am interested on why we can't offer an option that in my mind increases our transparency and is more democratic way to let people be on the record. I'm I'm not wholly convinced it's one or the other. like we we we offer options on the website all the time and we offer people to bring their input and choose something. So, I'm I'm gonna hold off on supporting it this week because I really think I need to take it up offline with the clerk's office and really have clarity, but I'm all for protecting residents, but I'm also for people being on the record to stand up for what they what they believe in. So, thank you. Thank you, Mr. Clerk. Any further comments? Thank you. I'll just say that part of it is it's resources in my office to manage that and there are always tight time frames around cut offs for submission of correspondence and delegation requests and even with this it's still going to require additional work on behalf of my staff to for instance take Mr. Smith that lives at 123 John Street and look up to see what ward number they are because not everyone knows what ward they live in. So even though that will be an option on the forum, it's a capacity issue. Thank you. Thank you. Respectfully, the administrative side, if that's what it takes, I guess we'll figure that out. It's not a reason not to do something if it if it enhances accountability and democratic practice. So anyway, I'll talk to you offline about this. Thank you so much. Thank you, Madam Chancellor. Next time my speakers list is councelor Leu. Thank you madam chair. Um thank you councelor Shu for for this motion. Um I am leaning towards supporting this motion cuz you know 140 letters was uh mentioned and uh it's from my motion and sorry about that. Um but uh you know I do receive a lots of uh requests about you know oh I didn't know that my information will be published. um can I you know take it off and um I don't want my address and the main reason from from that is is is identity um theft that has been mentioned and also fraud um people can look up to those list and then okay I know who and who lives on 123 John Street and then you know that's an identity issue with this time of age I think um is a very legitimate um concern so um I I don't have a problem um supporting this motion. Um but I just wanted to uh have some uh um clarification. Um first of all, if this motion passed, are we the only city that do this? What what what are other cities um and dealing with all these correspondents and and Mr. Clerk? Um thank you. I I I I can't answer because I did look at this briefly when councelor Shu and I were discussing this matter. Uh it's a mixed bag. Some municipalities have addresses, some don't, some have ward numbers, some don't. Some it there is no standard. So it's my advice that this is a policy decision important to Richmond Hill Council what they think best. Thank you. All right. Thank you. And I also have a question about um point number three. I I don't quite understand what that means through you, Madam Chair. Mr. Clerk, thank you. And I'll thank Councelor Shu for allowing me to include this in the motion. Uh, one of the biggest challenges I was worried about bringing forth this motion is that if if council were to adopt this, then my office would get an influx of asking us to change old records um and using this motion as well. No, clearly that's the policy. Well, there we are talking about public official records that we don't want to on mass start changing in fact it would be problematic it it would be very problematic I'm not sure we could even continue it so I asked that you know counselor to consider including this in his motion that says that no no the policy and it is sound and and and and and councelor Leu you you'd said that some people say that they didn't know that their their information was going to be included in the agenda Well, every time we receive correspondence or delegation requests, we actually send an email to that person saying your name and address will be included in the public record. We actually, and that's not technically obligated, but we go even a step further than what's required. Um, so this was to say, no, no, no. The let's this is going forward. This is, you know, a new policy decision. We're going to implement it for the official records going forward. the procedure that I talked about earlier that we have for those very unique cases will remain in force in effect. Uh and that's what this sorry I missed that. Uh what what's what are those unique cases? So uh thank you through the chair. I I I have put it into place under the access and privacy policy and it's a good practice best practice in municipalities a procedure that we will consider redacting someone's address only from the online public version only of official records um when there is serious not mere speculation threat to their health and safety or their well-being as a as a result of and we I will tell you we have done it for people based on their career their professional career where there is clear evidence of high risk of having their address in the public realm. Uh I mentioned we would do it if someone had a restraining order or a protection order against someone uh as a way of protecting. So it it achieves a balance of actually protecting people's health and safety while maintaining the integrity of the public record. Madam city manager, you wanted to add something uh through you madam chair. Uh just uh perhaps a um a consideration uh for council at this point uh due to the discussion on this matter. I'd like to perhaps have it come back to staff uh to take into context the comments that we're hearing today so we have an opportunity to talk about resources and process and uh come back uh to council next week with kind of a recommended approach for your consideration. Okay. Yes. I councelor Leano, you you have the floor, but I I would agree with that. Carry on, sir, if you want to move that. Thank you, Madam Chair. No. Um, no. Um, I'll I'll let uh councelor Shield do it, but uh but you know, I I just I I think that's all my questions. Um cuz so far I have one resident is very very um concerned about, you know, his name and address been published. Um I just wanted to go back and you know I know the the agenda has been adopted sometimes you know they received the email I appreciate that the clerk's department send an email telling them that okay it will be public record but you know sometimes it it's it's you know after the adoption of the agenda after the motion is passed and then they realize oh my god you know my my name and address is on on on on online so at least you know for that you know resident um I would like to take him off the list online at least you know you can keep the paper record I I I don't have a problem but you know that's a conversation maybe next week but uh um that's my only asks um yeah thank you okay forward to uh next week thank you sir next on my speakers list is councelor tree okay thank you so much uh madame chair so I do have a question regarding to the item B regarding to the uh the sentences about who are not residents of Richmond Hill I I No. Uh in some cases the motion passed or motion discussed on the floor summariz to us as well. For example the picky ball solution or strategies. So in that case so number B here we're just seeing whenever you're residents of Richmond Hill or you out our boundary your city your address has to be there right. I think this may be the P transparency. We need to know who are interesting our own city business. If you are influencers come from other cities, your name should be here. All council members should say that this is coming from Markham or one which is participating in our script uh our our city's business. Is that case number two? B. Uh Mr. Clerk. Um thank you to the chair. I I certainly read B exactly like that. So if someone lives in Richmond Hill, their name and ward number would be but if someone lived in they wanted to speak to council and they were from Vaughan or Markham or Toronto or wherever it would say you know Mrs. Smith city of Markham. Okay, perfect. That's what we're looking for. Thank you so much. Thank you councelor uh councelor Thompson is next. Um thank you very much. I wasn't actually going to speak uh originally, but uh after councelor Leu brought up the comment about uh item three and then listening to what the city manager said, perhaps um I think it's the wording here where where it says that no changes to past council committee records said where it says shall be authorized. I think that's probably the the real hiccup here because to go with what the city clerk has mentioned about somebody who is now at risk, they may not have been at risk at the time of the uh the particular document that got to the public record, but you know, they shouldn't they have that opportunity to come and say, can you take that down? Mr. clerk. Um, thank you. Uh, through your chair, and it's a great question, counselor. I don't read that clause that way at all. Um, it broadly speaks about, um, uh, all the council committee public records. Uh, the procedure that I've already put in place under the access and privacy policy would still remain in effect. Uh, and is consistent with the MIPA. I don't read that clause as saying I can't do that. In fact, I would suggest that I actually have an obligation to do that as head underbuff council. Uh if if that's the interpretation, I think that's what everybody needs to be able to interpret the same way because I have to admit I didn't interpret it that way. So, okay. Uh thank you. Those are my comments. Okay. Anybody else on the first round who hasn't spoken? See none. Okay. I just have a few comments. Um, I I defin I will hand it back over to to my colleague um for a a wrap up and see if he would like to um defer this to next week. Um, I just have a couple of questions. Um, Mr. Clerk, would should this motion pass, would this require the procedure bylaw to be rewritten next year, next term? Um, thank you through the chair. Uh, yeah, there would be. Yes, there would be um minor tweaks to uh the portion of the um procedure bylaw that speaks to uh public participation and and based on clause two of the motion as is, I would bring forward that amending bylaw at a future council meeting. Okay. Thank you. Yeah. I um I I've I've been a I've been a counselor u I've been honored to be a counselor for 12 years and in those 12 years I've only ever had two inquiries of of this kind. Uh one was long time ago and um another one was a short time ago. So um given given that and you look at the percentages I I I I really believe that we have done the right thing. However, there are two things that I do understand. I do understand in this data age where everybody knows everything that there there are concerns. I absolutely understand that and if there is a way that we can um assist our residents to to protect that then I believe it is written in here. Um and the excuse me the other is of course the internet and everything's on the internet and once it's on the internet it can be removed. So um it's very difficult to to have anything done retroactively because it's already on the internet and it could have already been copied. Um, so I um I agree with councelor Davidson um that there's a there's a balance here that that we have to um that that we have to do and I know you and I have spoken about this um quite a bit Mr. And um I if as long as we are um as long as as long as the public record is being serviced as it should, then I believe whatever comes out of this motion um if that services the public record as well as the needs and wants of the of private residents residents um then then I I I believe we we're checking our boxes. But as as councelor Davidson said, this is a public this is a public forum and if you put your name in to speak or you put your name in uh to or you you send a communication to the clerk's office which is an email which will be included in the agenda in the additions. Again, it's a public record. So we have to we have to always be sure that the public uh record and the public's needs and wants are being met appropriately thinking back also to how are we protecting in independent residents um uh needs and wants as well. So this is I I can appreciate that this is this is a very this is a very fine line. So um thank you. I'm just looking at my I'm just looking at my notes. Okay. So, um I do believe it's prudent. Um but that's up to councelor Shu. Um so there are no more speakers. Oh. Oh, I'm sorry. Okay. Go ahead. Uh one more one more add in. Go ahead. Uh regional councelor Depala. Thank you, Madam Chair. I I didn't didn't uh initially think I needed to speak, but I just I want to say that I really support this. I really think it's a great uh that um council shoes brought this forward. Uh think things have changed. used to be a time where everybody's name and address and phone number was published in the phone book and it was we all knew where everyone lived and when they came here it was it was important. I remember when we originally discussed this, we wanted to know um who who was addressing us and we wanted to know where they where they lived and factored it into our decision and um but I think this motion covers that but protects for this this new world where um uh if you're searching for someone's address, a a lot of times you you you're not able to find where they live unless they gave uh deputation at a local border. or something that that so you know once AI has an ability to get an address everyone has the ability to get your address and this is important to protect our residents so the motion covers it off well we're going to know more or less where they live um as you know is this a Richmond Hill resident or not that's really the only thing we need to know um and but we need to protect because the last thing we want to do is prevent people in Rich Mill from coming forward. We need to encourage in every way possible the participation and engagement in our decision- making. So I I support the motion today and next week and I'm I'm glad grateful for this discussion. Thank you councelor. I appreciate you bringing up the bell phone book. I think we all we all remember we all remember it. Um and it'll be in you know the history books and museums at some point. But um yes indeed we did all have our and we had no say in that. None whatsoever. Belle produced that. It was what it was. Um just if I may just before I hand it back to councelor Shu for for a wrap up and and and perhaps a change um if I may clerk if should this pass next week um a a counselor would be able to contact you or the clerk's office and ask you confidentially what what is the address of that person. I'm so sorry to put you in this position, but I just I just wanted to know, can counselors get that information from you because say I see something and I go, "Oh, you know what? I'd like to contact that person." As you say, the person should also be contacting us. Um, would we be able to do that or is this going to slam a door? I'm so sorry to put this to you, but it's Thank you, Madam Chair. It's actually a great question and and um it's a very unique scenario. Uh my office would be able to give you that address if we had the consent of the person to whom it relates. Got it. So, and I have thought about this uh when discussing this motion with councelor Shu ahead of time. Um and certainly I I would be and this is also why actually my recommendation was that this not take place till next term is because we'd have to put in place some process changes and one of those things that I have to look at is as part of the the the submission is can we give them the option and it has to be an option to disclose their email address or home address or whatever address they provide to individual members of council. Mhm. Uh and this just aligns with the rules in Mippen the Municipal Freedom Information Privacy Act and the interpretation of the information privacy commissioner which says individual members of council have no greater right to personal information in the hands of the than than a member of the public. So I I can't just give you personal information that would be against the the rules. So there has to be consent and that's why we need some time to work through this process um that if this is adopted to figure out how we could obtain that consent once again completely voluntarily uh and track it and and know without overburdening the staff. So that's that's also why one of the exact reasons why I recommended to the counselor that we not start this till the next term because that it's going we have few meetings left this year and it's going to take me time to go my staff time to go through that whole process. Thank you very much Mr. Kirk. I appreciate that. Okay so um I've see no more uh no more uh hands up here. I'll give it back to councelor Shu who is the mover and if you wish to wrap up or if you wish to uh defer this it's completely up to you. Thank you madam chair. Uh I just want to emphasize one more time the rationale behind this motion is it's all about how the way how to publish the personal information on public record but there's nothing about the verifying process and the city clerk office will do the same thing as before to verify the personal information behind internally. So it's nothing about the verifying process but the way to publish on the pop on the public record only. This is the spirit of this motion to protect the personal information and privacy of our delegates and and and we will encourage them to show up and speak in the council if under this new system and referring to the options uh giving to the uh delegates. Actually we have talked to uh this is my initial idea at the beginning to give the option for the delegates to show the address or not but referring to the clock cler office is challenges to to to to carry out because it would due to uh uh administrative burden to to ask everybody to ask every single delegates if you want to show or not this will be a tons of work to do. So I think is is um strike the balance of protecting the personal information and also encourage them and and also encourage and preserve the transparency. I think showing the word number is just spread the balance of the both sides. So that's why I my suggestion is just just putting the word number here and just get back to the point by councelor Davidson's about maybe uh uh uh deferring to next week just want to ask city close is there any information additionally add to this motion if if we need more information about this motion so because I don't think there's any special or any difference between if we defer to next week or just pull out the separate item for discussion next week. There's no difference actually. Mr. Clerk, um thank you through the chair. There's no more information that I I would provide short of answering any questions that arise as a result of this. So, which uh I'm always happy to do. So whether you refer this without recommendation to council next week or adopt it here, it's still if it wants to be pulled out and discussed next week, uh I would certainly be happy to uh answer any questions that arise and talk to any member of council between now and then. So it it really doesn't matter one way or another from my perspective. Counselor. Yeah. So there's I think there's no difference between to pull out the separate item for discussion next week or just defer to next week and my council colle this week for further information actually. So I don't think it's necessary to defer to the next week. Yeah. So those all my comments uh and just get back to madam chair. Thank you. Uh, councelor Davidson, second round. Yes. Thank you. Um, if we defer it and discuss it next week, we can still vote on it next week. My problem is I don't want to vote no to it. I just want more information. So, if we have the vote today, I have to vote no because I need more information. If we defer it till next week, then I can support it full throatated if I if I have the information I'm seeking. So, do I put forward a motion to defer it or refer it? I always get those two mixed up. I take you through the chair. If that's you your wish, you actually can put forward a motion to refer this without recommendation directly to council. Uh which is not voting for or against it. It's just to, you know, not really make a decision on it until next week and it'll appear on the agenda next week as is if that's the motion and decision of the committee. Right. So because I don't want to vote no, I just need more information. I would like to move to defer it till next week when we'll have a discussion and a vote and that way perhaps it'll be unanim unanim unanimous however you say it. Okay. Okay. Okay. So, uh Mr. Clerk, do you want to put it on the on the screen or it's not necessary? Okay. So, so we have a motion on the floor now which takes precedence uh to defer this uh council shoes motion uh to full discussion next week. Um all those in favor any opposed? Seeing none, that carries unanimously. Thank you very much. That's very very interesting discussion. Okay, so now I can go back to agenda item 13. We have no emergency and time-sensitive matters. And just before I call for adjournment, this is my final uh my final day. Yes, it is. Um this is my final day sitting in the uh the rotating chair for committee of the whole and um it's been an honor as it always is and I want to thank staff um especially uh um the clerk and the deputy clerk and all the clerks for um for everything and everything that they do to to enable this meeting to come to where it is. and to all the other members um who were seated here today who are also who are also um uh very very instrumental in ensuring that this committee of the whole agenda comes to council um in its correct form. So I want to thank you all. I want to thank you members of council uh very much and I will hand it over to w 6 counselor Michael Shu who will take over from the next committee of the whole in two weeks time. Thank you again very much. And for that, who would like to move to adjourn? Councelor Shu. Thank you.

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