The live stream has begun. Okay. When when I get the signal, we'll call the meeting to order. >> Fireworks. >> There. There it is. Okay. So, I call this meeting to order. Uh budget committee of the whole meeting. Um purpose today is really to get an update from our financial staff uh our capital project financial status and our uh forecast for 2026 year end. So um you have the agenda before you. Can I get a a motion to adopt the agenda? Thank you councelor Silvitz. Any discussion there? All in favor? Any opposed? That carries unanimously. Okay. Any members of the committee have a disclosure of pecuniary interest? I see none. Okay, we don't have any delegations. We go right to our scheduled business. And the the first item 5.1 is a capital project financial status report and a presentation by GI Lee, our director of financial services and treasur up to 15 minutes with this presentation. Go ahead, Miss Lee. Good afternoon, budget Dala and members of the committee. We have two related reports that are before the budget committee today. The first one is the 2026 capital project financial status report. The second being the 2026 year and operating forecasts. These reports are provided to council annually detailing forecasts for use of budgeted funds of the operating programs as well as the capital projects. The first report which is the capital project financial status report covers project closures, budget and funding adjustments, time critical in-ear additions as well the status of open capital projects as of June 30th, 2026. The purpose of this report is to give committee a mid-year picture of where our capital program stands, which projects are complete and ready to close, what surplus funding can be returned, and what adjustments are needed on active projects, and how the overall open project portfolio is tracking against the approved budget. This slide highlights the net picture at a glance. Closing 186 projects in appendix A will return $15 million into the reserves and reserve funds. Offsetting that, the budget adjustments require a draw of $4.16 million. The net result is almost $11 million being returned to reserves and reserve funds, which will strengthen our funding position heading into the next budget cycle. This slide highlights the projects that are being closed. It covers the projects recommended for closure. As I mentioned, the total will be $16 million of available remaining budget. Of that, $15 million is recommended to be returned to funding sources while $1.1 million is being recommended to be reallocated to other projects where the work is still required. The returns are broken down in the report as well as here by departments and funding sources. This is a strong indicator of disciplined budget and cost management by our project teams. This slide highlights appendix B of the staff report. It sets out the project budget adjustments as well as the funding changes. These are adjustments to active projects where scope, timing or market pricing or funding sources had to be changed to the to the original approval and where council is required to uh council approval. It's required to realign the budget and funding is needed for inyear capital budget additions. As you can see from the top left top left corner of the slide, we have consolidated a number of capital projects to streamline administration and they have no financial impact. The bottom left highlights the recoveries from external sources as well as proceeds from the sale of assets. To the right, budget and funding adjustments as well inear capital budget additions are outlined in the following slides. Walking through the budget and funding adjustments in more detail. The adjustments identified on this slide highlight the projects, the change in budget required and the funding sources that are being drawn or released in the report. Collectively, these adjustment results in a net draw of $4.16 million from the reserves and reserve funds, which is the amount included in the recommendation. As you can see on this slide, as a result of favorable tender pricing achieved through early tendering, the budgets for four road reconstruction projects can be reduced. And that's the $4 million that's shown on the slide. Moving to the bottom of the slide, additional budget is requested for the aerot truck due to market escalation and for the completion of phase two of the cultural center renovation. Moving on to the next slide. Consistent with the capital budget financial monitoring policy, budget adjustments approved by council or deleated authority are highlighted in appendix C. What you see on this slide and the report are the projects that are exceeding $100,000 which would require council approval. This slide highlights the in-ear time critical capital budget additions identified since the adoption of the 2026 budget. These projects are needed that require timely approval and they're typically driven by emerging operational service delivery as well as asset management needs. As you can see on this slide, there are four construction projects being requested largely to address asset management needs, achieve procurement efficiencies and to maintain project as well as service delivery. The design of Brody House Park that was a council direction from June. So that has been included in this report as well as an addition. And then last but not least, the early implementation of the tennis and pickle ball strategy requires the negotiation of a commercial lease agreement with Metro Links. So we have included that um as one of the budget additions here and this is to ensure that we have the seasonal courts that will be operational in the spring of 2027. This table highlights the status of the open capital as of June. After the projects are closed, the 186 that we just spoke about, we will have 482 open projects that are ongoing. And as you can see on the slide, we have spending to date of almost $140 million, expected spend of another $82 million. And then you see that the future year figure on the far right corner reflects the multi-year nature of much of our infrastructure work. So those are budgets that will be used in the future years. The recommendations of the report are before you. Uh chair depala that concludes my first presentation and I'm available to answer any questions related to this. >> Okay. Thank you very much. Uh, okay. Thank you for that update. So, uh, we got a recommended motion on the floor. Someone like to move that, uh, first first speaker, Deputy Mayor Garvin Chan. >> Thank you very much, uh, Mr. Chair, and thank you, Miss Lee. I'm so touched. I'm now back to meetings after the summer. >> Yes. Uh, but thank you. This is serious stuff we're talking about. Particularly, we're talking about big money like to me anyway. Uh, so I'm happily moving first. Um, oh, you need is it only rel to presentation, Mr. Chair, or you want me to move recommendation? >> I'd like uh the motion on the floor if you're willing to do that. >> I'll be happy to move the recommendation A, B, and C. Um, >> thank you. >> Thank you for that. So, it's a motion uh on the table. Um, thank you for the presentation and it's always nice to have u I like the word sherpress. Um the only well not only the one of the questions I have is through you Mr. chair to director Lee um because I don't want to just look at one year this is only one year uh but how's it compared to our prior years is that seems to be a pattern that uh because of very prudent and also technical uh management of the capital projects um that the city had been experiencing uh on counter surplus quite often. often uh from year to year or this is quote unquote exceptional year through you Mr. chair >> through the chair to deputy mayor Chan. So um it is a strong indicator of discipline budget and cost management by the project teams and I would say it is a trend that we've experienced over the last few years um especially so in this report um because it is the first time that we're presenting this in the year of 2026. So there there are more projects being closed. That's why you're probably seeing a a slightly elevated number, but overall the trend is about the same. >> Thank you. Well, that's the good news to hear. So, so it's not just one year wonder, but it has been I hear the word trend. So, it's more than one year it's been uh having the surplus. So, that's great. Thank you very much to all staff engaged in uh uh managing um the uh projects and we are able to close some of them. Um and relating to to that uh on item C of the recommendation now am I correct to interpret help me interpret through Mr. chair from director Lee. Um while B2 of the motion is say returning money uh surplus to the sources that have been identified but C would mean net draw. It means new money being drawn from uh the reserve or is it something that goes above and beyond what initially what the capital funding might have been allocated through M. Help me understand through Mr. Okay. >> Slides. >> Oh, is a slide. I'm going to take us back to slide three. Uh, through the chair. So, as as you've noted, Deputy Mayor Chen, the $15 million is still returns from the project closures. The $4 million is the net ask for the additional budgets and then overall the net return will be almost $11 million. So, the 4.16 does represent a draw for those projects. >> Okay. Thank you. Uh so through Mr. Chair uh director Lee would that mean this is 4.16 million to withdraw which meaning the capital project now in terms of projected estimated expenses would be higher than what the initial allocated you know maybe this year last year or the year before last three Mr. Sure, >> Mr. Chair. That's correct. So, this number represents the emerging needs since the adoption of the 2026 capital budget. So, this is over and above. >> Okay. So, it's some plus, some gains or some minor, so to speak. But thank you. So, $10.9 million is the net being returned, which is still a very good number. Um the very last um question or comment uh one of the slides is say 0.5 million if I see it correctly relating to early implementation of tennis and pickle ball strategy. Um I know we're talking about money here. Could you please elaborate a little bit to the extent that you are aware of? Director Lee uh is also one before this I guess at the very bottom there's something about early implementation right there exactly pennies and pickle ball strategy early implementation I'm glad I still remember correctly.5 million so any uh help me or us understand um what sort of early implementation may be undertaking through Mr. here >> uh through the chair um perhaps I can start on this. So essentially that budget amount is required for as you noted the early early implementation of the tennis and pickle ball strategy and primarily for the negotiation of a commercial lease agreement with Metroinks so that we can enable the seasonal um pickle ball courts to be operational by spring of 2027. >> Okay. Thank you. So the half a million dollars is presumably for consultant legal fees things of that nature because sounds to me is primarily relating to negotiation of that contract >> through the chair. That's correct. Yeah. >> Okay. Thank you. Thank you Mr. Chair and thank you Dr. Lee and uh my move of the motion stands. So we'll be look forward to hearing from my colleagues. Thank you Mr. Chair. >> Okay. Thank you. So we have a motion on the floor. Next speaker is uh councelor Silvitz. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. Good afternoon, everybody. It's great to be back. Um I just have a couple of questions. First of all, thank you, Treasurer Lee, for very good report. On page on slide seven, I just have an a couple of questions. Um just referring back to what Deputy Mayor um Chan was referring to. We're talking about the West Gormley property. Is that right? the for Metro links >> for the pickle ball >> through the chair. That's correct. >> That's correct. Okay. Thank you. I just wanted to make 100% sure about that. Um now, um very glad to see solar panels being installed on Tom Graham. Um is there any through to to through you, Mr. Chair, or to our treasurer or to our commissioner? Um is there any possibility that we're going to do that to more public facilities? Commissioner Not to put you on the spot, I'm just wondering. It's just such a great idea >> through the chair to councelor Silivitz. Thank you for the question. We have done a robust study of all of our facilities and where we can and cannot facilitate them. This is the one through that analysis that came out on top as one where the facility would best suit solar panels. There's a lot of complexity into determining whether or not a facility can accommodate it without getting into, you know, too many details. >> Okay. No, that's terrific. Thank you very much. I appreciate that. And then just referring to the central library roof replacement. Um I also see our CEO Mr. Gman here and I don't know if he wants to help with this particular question. Um is this going to require any further closure of the central library through you Mr. Chair to the comm commissioner? >> Through the chair to council silvitz no like any other facility where we replace the roof. We do not require the closure of a facility in order to rehabilitate the roof. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Facility. >> Thank you. And that'll be done while we're also preparing the Dave Baris Civic Square. It's kind of like the same timeline. >> Yes, that is correct. >> Okay. Thank you. And to if I may through you Mr. Chair to CEO Gorman, not to put you on the spot, would you like to give us an update on the central library um renovations and how we doing? I think it opened today, didn't it? >> Considering it is capital and infrastructure >> just uh half an hour, an hour ago, uh it is amazing. I can't wait to show you guys what we've what we've done is we have recreated on the inside a modern library of today. Uh it's going to be stunning in the things we're going to be able to do there going forward. It's going to transform the city, I'm sure. I often say that the city, we're the center of the city. Um, and there's not many places where the city can come together, but now they have an amazing space when they come together. So, we're working on it. It'll be ready uh for all of you to come and join us probably in uh in January when it's done, but it's open today. >> That's fantastic. I'm I'm going to pop by. >> Yes, please do. Thank you. >> Thank you very much. And those are all my questions. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Okay, next speaker is councelor Shu. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you, Treasury, and your team for your great effort. And uh some of the questions covered by my colleagues already. So, I have only one quick questions. Uh I'm happy to see that around 10 million uh $10 million is being returned to reserve and reserve fund with about $5.2 million going back to DC reserve fund. Uh we understand the city receives some fundings from the provincial government, but the DC shortfall could have a significant impact over the next few years. So would it be possible to put even more of the surplus into the DC reserve fund to prepare for the years ahead? Is the $5.2 million the best we can do through Mr. Chair? through the chair to councelor Shu. So the as noted in the report, the $5.2 million represent the DC funding sources that were um the DC funding that was originally drawn for growth related projects and now that the projects are completed, we will return them back to source. So to answer your question about whether we can provide more funding into the DC reserve funds, um unfortunately DC's are legislated, they're statutory reserve funds and they can only be used for the purpose of growth related projects. The so the same way that we can only collect from growth, we can only spend it on growth. So we we wouldn't really use another funding source um to top up the DC reserve funds. >> So that means there's no way to put additional uh surplus back to the DC reserve fund. There's no other way under the current regulations. Is right >> because I'm I'm quite worried about the DC shortfall in the coming years. So I just raised this question >> through the charity counselor shoot. So, so there are mechanisms, but I think we also have to think about whether we want to go ahead with that because obviously we have funding sources and reserve funds established for different purposes. >> So, in topping up the DCs with other funding sources, we're potentially shortch changing other funding as well. >> Okay. Thank you. Uh that's all my comments and questions. Thank you, Mr. Chair. >> Okay. Thank you. Uh, next speaker is councelor Davidson. >> Thank you. Thank you for the report. I do have a couple of questions. One is the Metro Links um, pickle ball. What is the estimated cost for that? Because I I think like my suggestion when I brought it forward was that we have we utilize the space that's not being utilized at the moment, but it can't be at any cost. So, I was really thinking low, but I like are we having are we talking about massive amounts of money for this thing? Like is it over 25,000 30,000? Like where are we looking at the range? I know it was quite high before. I know. I I just want to publicly talk about like I I personally I don't think it's coming back to council, right? Are you Mr. Chair? Is it coming back to council? the metro links >> uh through you Mr. here. Uh the cost I think that's associated with the budget that's in front of you on the capital side is for those negotiations to take place. Um there will be cost associated with those courts because there's certainly maintenance costs of involved and uh and there are some costs that we're negotiating in terms of uh the land that those courts will go on. But that's uh a Cole's note summary in open session. >> Thank you. um through Mr. Chair, but we it's not coming back to council for approval. Is that right? Like the negotiation doesn't come back for us to say yay or nay. I'm just worried it didn't occur to me that it would be I it occurred to me money would be spent, but the it's only worthwhile if it's economical to do that rather than building something more permanent ourselves. So, I'm asking what's the cap on that? >> Uh through you, Mr. Chair. Uh so we'll um consult with staff uh in terms of what will come back to council uh for the agreement with Metro Links. Um but we have direction from council at this point to proceed >> right. I I know I'm not sure it will come back >> right through you Mr. Chair. I I'm just >> It'll come back through budget at some point. >> Yeah. Like I mean I know you you guys think of all the angles and and if there was some way that it would be so expensive to use that that you would say you know what for a little more we could build something permanent blah blah blah. That's all that's concerning me. Um thank you. Um and my other question is the solar panels. I'm happy we're doing that. I just want to know for you Mr. Chair when is that start to pay off? Like that's a lot of money for installation. Where's the electricity going? And how many years will it take till we're we've broken even and we're moving on and actually saving some energy money because we have solar panels now or is it being sold >> uh through the chair to councelor Davidson? um as we've noted in in the report is an estimated payback of 9 years and that's incorporating the um the incentive that we anticipate of $318,000. So the total cost minus the incentive we're looking at about 9 years for for payback, right? So then you m So in nine years it's it's gravy, right? We're going to pay it off and then we still get to get the energy and Okay, great. Thank you. Okay, that's it. Thanks. >> Great. Thank you. Next speaker is Councelor Thompson. >> Uh thank you very much and uh thank you for the presentation and the report. Uh just a couple of quick questions. Um one of the things I noticed is that uh by June 30th we had only uh expended approximately 36% of forecasts. Is that typical? like are are things generally back end of the are the the later parts of the year that we typically get our expenditures. Um that's my question >> through the chair to councelor Thompson. Uh short answer is yes and that's why in the report we also estimate the anticipated spend for the entire year as well but perhaps commissioner Misaro can add to that chair to councelor Thompson build on treasur's comments typically in construction we do see most of the invoicing come in towards the latter half of the year even the first quarter the subsequent year and because most projects projects are multi-year projects as well. You'll see that the most of the money that the municipality uh has currently unspent, you know, sits within that, you know, one to four and five year mark and generally everything beyond five years is what is a lot smaller in the in the remaining balance of the city's open capital and in many instances to take into consideration as well. Uh a good portion of that is also projects delivered by third parties. Be it projects that the region is delivering on our behalf where we fund or items that we put into the capital budget that are delivered uh by the development community. >> Okay, I appreciate that. Thank you. Very comprehensive, too. Thank you. Um the other thing that caught my eye uh was in the report in uh the 2022 budget uh we were looking at the replacement of the aerial uh fire truck and uh at that time the budget was 1.5 million and when I look at the report today it's bringing a revised budget of approximately 3.23 million. So that really that number really jumped out at me. And at the same time, I I I certainly understand where we've been and where where we are today. And I also understand where we might be tomorrow. Um, so getting that uh aerial truck in there, do we actually have the opportunity to get that truck before other imposing uh types of expenditures could push that number up even higher >> through the chair? I'm going to defer that to the chief. >> Uh through the chair to councelor Thompson. Thanks for the question. Um that number is alarming for sure. We've seen a lot of uh increases to the cost of fire apparatus over the last few years. Um exponential to be honest. Uh so we have taken measures now. We've been able to find uh a suitable truck that's going to meet our needs and meet the needs of the municipality. Um that's almost ready. It's under construction. It's about 80% build. We're actually going to get it very quickly. We have to jump now. And the recommendation that's before you is to allow us to do that and then avoid any potential other escalations that we think might be coming in the future with the climate that we're in. >> Thank you, Irene. Very diplomatic about what other escalations might entail. Um >> uh and I appreciate that. So yes, I I I wholeheartedly support the direction here and I appreciate that you provided that clarification. Thank you so much. Uh those are all my questions. Okay, so that exhausts the speakers list that I had and um for myself I just have one question. Um I think it's fantastic. We've saved almost $5 million by early tendering or at least it was attributed to that. Is it strictly the result of early tendering on on those projects? Um it it and is are we going to get hurt next year when we're we're we won't be able to convene as a budget committee and we won't be able to wrap things up in December because I think the fact that we're done in se in December and we're getting out there first tender for projects it's more competitive we're getting better prices is that going to be affected next year >> through the to for the chair. Um so definitely that with the timing of the budget approval, it does mean that our procurement process um or public procurement process will start a little bit later. Um, but I do want to point out that staff are also working diligently internally uh to make sure that we're getting all the work done um so that we can have all the documents and every ready so that when the budget is approved then we can go ahead and make sure that we get to the market as early as we can. >> Great. Thank you. Okay. So um well it's a significant advantage and u something for us to keep in mind to try and continue. It's the same every municipality is in the same boat with the elections and um you know if we get get here quickly and get down to work and we appreciate um financial staff um getting all the work done behind the scenes um then be ready for when we do reconvene as a as a council. So, uh, that was my only question and we've got a motion on the floor from Deputy Mayor Chan. All in favor? Any opposed? That carries unanimously. Okay, we move to U business item 5.2, which is the 2026 year-end operating forecast and and also again a presentation from GG Lee, our director of financial services and treasur. Go ahead and >> thank you. Turning now to the second report which is the year and operating forecast. This report provides the mid-year results and the projected year-end position for both tax supported as well as the rate supported operations. In this section, I'll walk through the operating forecast, the main pressures that are on the tax supported budget, the offsetting opportunities we've identified, and also provide an update on the rate supported outlook for water, wastewater, and storm water. The objective of the year and forecasting process is to provide visibility and transparency into the emerging budget pressures across the organization, enabling staff and leadership to identify mitigation strategies and make informed adjustments as needed. Staff are expected to take mitigating actions where appropriate to ensure that the city remains aligned with the approved net operating budget by year end. This table sets the sets out the mid-year position by department. At midyear, the total tax supported budget is almost $80 million and it shows an unfavorable variance of almost $4 million or 105% of the budget. The largest pressure sits within community services and in planning and building services where mid-year spending is at 109 and 142% respectively. This is due to high winter maintenance costs, fire and emergency services staffing as well as lower development revenues and these are partially offset by some of our tax related revenues. Importantly, the year and forecast column at the very far right shows the total returning to 100%. and remains aligned with the approved net operating budget largely through these corporate accounts that I mentioned and the offsetting opportunities that I'll cover shortly. This slide highlights the key pressures as noted on the slide. Development planning revenues are forecasting $2.5 million below budget. This is reflecting a slowdown in construction activity and lower building permit volumes. staff continue to monitor development activity and are advancing service improvement initiatives as part of 2026. Also noted on the slide is their winter maintenance costs that are $1.5 million over budget following uh a very busy Q1 in 2026 when it comes to weather. Fire and emergency services staffing is approximately $1.2 $2 million unfavorable and this is largely driven by overtime shift premiums and health related absent to use them. Just going through the rest of the slide, recreation programming, sponsorships and rentals are lower by $700,000. And last but not least, facility management is about $400,000 higher, reflecting the maintenance needs of our aging facilities. Offsetting those pressures, we have a number of opportunities. The tax related penalties and interests are forecasted to be $2.3 million higher based on our higher outstanding balances. Assessment growth as approximately $1.3 million and this is due to the timing of budget approval and the final impact updates that we received after budget approval. As noted on the slide, we are anticipating approximately $800,000 in higher investment income. And this largely is resulted from our shift into short-term securities as we have in um the prior years. We are expecting $700,000 in payment in L of taxes from the York Region Orlando Drive transit property. So I understand the discussions are still ongoing between the province and the region. Therefore, we continue um to be able to collect this as an additional revenue. Last but not least, insurance premiums are lower than what we have forecasted and budgeted and this is following our move to a pulled program with York Region and other municipalities. And just a quick update, we also have a signed service agreement when it comes to that. Now on the rate supported side, water wastewater is forecasting a 7.2 million surplus and the largest driver related to that is that one time almost $6 million credit that we're getting back from the York region and it's related to the inaccurate billings from 2025. Volumes are also trending above budget this year due to the dry summer, generating additional revenues, and they're partly offset by higher water purchases. As noted on the slide, the storm water management fund is forecasting uh $140,000 in surplus, and that largely has to do with favorable property tax classification changes. the recommendation on the report of the report it's it's highlighted on the slide Mr. Chair that concludes the second presentation. >> Okay. Thank you very much. Uh so we'll deal we'll deal with it again in the same manner. Uh we'll have questions and and a motion at the same time. Anyone want to move the recommendations in the staff report? Uh Mr. prayer. Go ahead. >> Well, thank you very much and um thank you very much uh Treasurer Lee and all of your staff and and all of the the um the folks that work here to to help put this on because I know this is absolutely a team effort. Um I um I I don't really have any questions. I I I realize though as I'm listening to this presentation and all the others that we've heard up to this point how unbelievably complex this job is in balancing something as large and with so many moving parts as a municipal budget. And I just I I really it never ceases to amaze me ever since I've been on this council. Um, and you know, being that we're in the environment that we're in right now with u that little election thing coming up, um, it it really um, amazes me when I have discussions with people at the door and and and so on that just how complex some of these issues is, issues are. It's not just a matter of, hey, I'd like to pay less taxes. I mean, we all would like to pay less taxes, but the reality is, you know, in this particular report, um, you know, mother nature throws a whole bunch of snow at us and and, you know, and we're going to be over on our winter mainten maintenance budget. And there's all kinds of other variables that we, you know, we don't directly um, control, but yet at the same time, we're planning on mitigating strategies all the time to make sure that the the money that's spent in the corporation is spent wisely. and this update is a perfect example of that. Although there's many, many, many other perfect examples every time we're here at council listening to the staff present. So, I just want to say thank you. Um, you know, I think this is, um, the main thing that I get out of this is is, you know, every year when we have this year-end operating forecast report and then the the final report at the end, I don't think we've ever been in a situation where there's been a substantial deficit even with some of the variables. And I think that speaks to the unbelievable careful uh, management that we do around here. And you know, we've had a couple of years in the last little while where we've had really substantial surpluses due to, you know, frankly, it was a market windfall, you know, for the most part. But, um, and that's great. I mean, if that happens, you know, bring it on. But we want to make sure that we are managing our finances as carefully as we possibly can so that we're mitigating any um any, you know, downsides that happen. And, you know, it's very, very difficult particularly in the economic environment that we're in. and then you throw some natural um weather stuff at us and it becomes even more difficult. So, I just want to say thank you very much and um I'll leave it at that and happy to move the motion. >> Okay, great. Thank you. So, with the motion on the floor, the next speaker is car uh councelor Davidson. >> Thank you. And through Mr. Chair, thank you for the report. Um these are pretty minor questions, but the sports dome, it says it's not quite utilized 100%. Um just wondering if I don't know if that's a huge deal but we do hear from um racket sports people is there any thought or opportunity in the future to make sure it's filled up by offering other things besides field sports in the dome something like badminton or tennis >> uh through you Mr. Chair. So, we are always uh re-evaluating our program offerings and trying to uh maximize our fill rates to the best ability we can. Uh this year for the Sports Dome is a bit of a transition year because as you might recall, this is the first year we've had the Sports Dome open all year round. And so that's that's why our forecast is off a little bit because we're speculating into the future without any real good precedent to base that on. Um so we we will uh hopefully get that adjusted in the future. >> Oh, great. Thank you. That seems fair. Um, and the other one I sort of caught my eye through, Mr. Chair, is 1.2 million over budget for fire and service, mainly because of um staffing levels, operation continuity. Um, I think last year there was maybe a half a million dollar overrun. I think if I recall correctly, it was regarding um dispatch. My question is that seems high as a as off. So what if anything can uh emergency management do to foresee these these overruns? I realize we're dealing with people here, but and and I don't know how to run a fire department, but is there ever a model where like there's four floater or five floater fire members of the fire service who fill and plug holes rather than it being expensive overtime. I I don't know if that's even possible, but I know for example in schools now they'll have full-time substitute teachers to fill in because there's a lot of absenteeism. So just ask if there's a better way to management manage this. So it's not an overage annually. >> Uh Mr. Chair, to the councelor, it's something we struggle with. Um you'll notice in the report that um WSIB has mentioned which are workplace injuries. So that we've seen a real increase in that. Uh currently we do not have an overstaffing if you want to call it that. Um there may be some options coming forward to council in the next little while to help us address this overtime issue. It has been going on for several years and it's not getting any better. Um, we're not the only ones. It's not just Richmond Hill dealing with this. All larger municipalities are dealing with this and trying to take action on staffing levels to accommodate. >> Thank you, Siri, Mr. Chair. So it seems to me that like even asking for more positions to offset the overtime seems more frugal to me. But can you explain how just briefly how how do you how do you decide how many folks you need every year? And are are there any efforts to offset overtime by maybe taking one or two more full-time staff so that there are people to plug holes maybe even just for that if you understand what I mean. Uh yes, through your chair to councelor Davidson. We we do our best to do that. Um there may be some staffing recommendations that come forward to help us address this this issue. Uh it is a hard thing to manage because we don't know when people are going to be off and like I said there's been a real escalation in the last 18 months to two years in um workplace injuries. So, we are trying to find a way to accommodate those absences through potentially additional staff. >> Okay, thank you. Those are all my questions. >> Okay, thank you very much. So, I Oh, councelor tree. >> Okay, thank you so much. Thank you our directors for your hard work. So, I just have a very simple one. So based on current status do we uh do you have a maybe a high level summary how many supplies we have here from all different operations. Do we have a surplus here or >> surplus? >> Uh through the chair to counselor tree if I may repeat the question you're asking about whether we're anticipating a surplus. >> That's right. Uh Mr. the chair again um no we are anticipating to come in and align with the budget. >> Okay sure I'll wait for the end of year when this officials budget in karma I'll see what is our operation final uh numbers. Thank you. >> Thank you and and councelor Leu >> thank you very much. Thank you for the um the report. Um just a few quick questions. What happened to the aquatic uh program? through you, Mr. Chair. >> Uh through you, Mr. Chair. Um you're referring to the slight underage in program. >> Yes. So, we believe what we're seeing is an effect of the economy with uh residents and people with less discretionary income. Uh recreation programs are usually one of the first things that people start to spend a little bit less on. And we think this year we're starting to see that impact. >> All right. and they choose not to learn to swim and Okay. All right. No, that's that's that's that's just fine. Um um talking about that um so the uh tax related revenues, so there's an increase of penalties and interest. Is it because the residents have trouble paying taxes on time through Mr. Chair? through the chair to councelor Leu. So the short answer is yes. So as much as we've started with our tax collection process, we are noticing and it's not just Richmond Hill. Um overall as we also um have these discussions with other municipalities to understand our situation as well. It is definitely the the the trend that we're seeing is that overall the tax rear are increasing. >> Yeah, that's that news. Um I think it's economy related. Um the other thing is in terms of the uh winter maintenance. Um so I I saw on the news that you know because of the super El Nino uh we're going to have a very warm winter. Is it going to >> All right. Sorry. So, is this is that going to change how we budget the winter maintenance? Did I say something wrong? >> Is does that change how we uh budget for winter maintenance? >> Great through you, uh, Mr. Chair. So, um, our budgeting, all of our budgeting, winter maintenance included, is is our best estimate. Um, and usually those estimates are based on averages of the last, uh, 3 to five years. So, we're it's just we're trying to hit the middle right here and and not be over or under by too much. We're trying to hit the middle. Um so, I I I think the answer to your question is no, it's not going to change how we budget. Um it's just the weather changes how far off our estimate is. >> Yeah. Got it. Yeah. Thank you. Rather have a surface next year. All right. Um I I think my uh my last one is uh um I'm aware that the school board is raising their uh gym rental fees for a lot like double. Um I I don't know if it's going to increase the demand for our community centers. Um just to want to, you know, throw it out there. Um I don't know how the rates of the community centers compared to the schoolboard. um but I think is now is is is comparable. So I I expect a a big a huge demand um for for gym rental for our community centers. That's just a comment. So thank you very much. >> Okay. Thank you. And uh we'll we'll go to a second round. Mayor West. >> Thank you. Uh so just a couple more quick questions then based on the discussion we've had. Um I I want to be clear like one of the things I was I I kind of implied in what I said in my first round was that it's also really important when we're doing a budget like this that we're not overcolcting uh above what we need. So for example with winter maintenance you know we don't want to collect more than we ultimately need for winter maintenance because that means that we're collecting more from the taxpayer. So, um I think it's, you know, every year I I mean I remember a couple of years where we've had surpluses that are very very small and that's actually great because unless the surplus comes from a windfall because the market did far better than we thought which is not coming from the taxpayer um then you know a zero is a good thing like not under not over but somewhere very very close to the line and snow removal is a good example like we can't predict what mother nature's going to do some years we're going to have more. Some years we're going to have less. But, you know, we don't want to be predicting that we need a whole bunch more and then not need it because then it goes to a surplus and that just means we've overcolcted from the taxpayer. We do not want to be adding more pressure. But on that note, am I wrong to assume uh that when like we have reserve funds for snow clearing and am I wrong to assume that in years where the snow clearing budgets a little high, we put it towards the surplus and when winter maintenance is uh a little low then we take it like we if we've overspent on winter maintenance, we take it from the surplus in the reserve fund. Is that is that how that works now or are are we doing it differently? >> Through the chair to Mayor West, we did have a snow removal reserve uh which we did deplete in 2025. >> Okay. >> So, as a result, any overages would have to um obviously be part reviewed as part of the operating budget and it would actually be the tax rate stabilization that would be the the default funding. >> Okay. But that's my point is that I mean when we have a situation like that there is a fallback position. So it reduces the need for us to collect more than we are likely going to need because if we collect X amount but we spend a bit more than X amount the additional surplus would come from a a reserve fund as opposed to a um another fund uh like a tax rate uh generated fund and that reserve fund over time will be um added back to as needed. like the tax rate stabilization is a good example of one where because we don't rely on that anymore and haven't for I believe the last four years. Um that reserve fund is now growing back to the point where it should be as opposed to where it used to be which was getting very depleted. Um, and again, that's just another example of really prudent and wise fiscal management that we we are seeing in every single budget. And that, you know, I think sometimes uh the public and and even us on council sometimes take it for granted that we, you know, that we're not doing those kinds of things, but we are. It's really it's really good sound management practices. And so I I appreciate that. So, thank you. >> Thank Thank you. So, that exhaust speakers list. Um, I I just want to make a few comments before we vote on the item. Um, and and I I just want to thank all of the people that uh have worked together for the last four years on on this uh budget committee. We've we've we've passed four different budgets. We've faced all sorts of adversity and challenges and and transitions and you know unlikely events that that we that were unforeseeable that were uh met and challenges that that were overcome. And I'm I'm really proud of the team, the senior management team uh led by our city manager, Darlene Johnson, our corporate services commissioner, and um of course uh our treasurer Gigi Lee, who's who's been there answering all our questions, breaking it down for us over the last four years. and your entire uh financial services team that that has has has done a great job. Uh this this will be our last meeting. So just before we make the call to vote on this last uh item, um I I just want to express my thanks. It's been an honor and um a real pleasure to serve as as the budget chair for this past term. So uh with that, I'll call the vote on the motion on the floor. All in favor? Any opposed? That carries unanimously. Thank you very much, committee. >> We have one more vote. Thank you. Deputy Mayor Chan, you wanted to move for adjournment. >> I'll be happy to move for the last motion for this budget committee on this. Thank you. >> Okay. Any discussion on adjourning this this meeting and this term of the budget committee? Oh, I I do uh before we adjourn want to thank uh Mayor West because um he he could he could just impose a budget upon us. This is this is we are making recommendations to him and he's he's opted to proceed in the manner that we have and he rightfully deserves the last word. Mayor West. >> Well, if you're going to thank me, I'm going to thank you. Um, I also do want to say thank you uh, regional local counselor Dalo for stepping up and being the budget chair from the beginning of this because it really uh has been very helpful and um, I realize legislatively that the the mayors that uh, in many municipalities now have the responsibility for the budget, but it has been great to work with you and your knowledge of all things budget has been very very helpful and I really appreciate that as well. So, thank you very much for not only chairing the meeting um but for continuing to to take on the same role as budget chair that you have since the beginning. So, thanks a lot. >> Okay. Thank you for thanking me, thanking you. All all in favor? Any opposed? That carries unanimously. Thanks.